Tag Archives: judges

Universal Scoring System

I’m not all into the politics of scoring or why there is such a hold up in the universal scoring system, but I believe that if someone just took charge and said “this is how it’s going to be” and didn’t let parents and/or coaches run things, then it would be a fast increase in making all-star cheer a sport. I always use gymnastics as an example because that’s where I originated from. I was a gymnast for over 12 years, and it didn’t matter which competition I went to, I knew I would always be scored the same way. Yes it has changed in the instance that level 7 is now optional and there is now no such thing as a perfect 10, HOWEVER, when the scoring system changed for gymnastics, it just changed. One fell swoop and boom, it was done. I’m sure there was a lot in the developing stages that we didn’t see or weren’t aware of, but as soon as it changed, that was it. Okay…this is how we’re doing gymnastics scoring now. I’m sure people were upset, but what are they going to do about it? Quit? THAT’S AWESOME…we don’t need the negativity!

In an industry like cheerelading every competition or  wants to stand out and be different, but I don’t think scoring should have ANYTHING to do with that. You can go to a JAMFest competiton, a UCA competition, and an Epic Brands competition and I guarantee, you can and will find 3 differnt things that you like (and possibly dislike) at each one of those competitions. Every cheerleading company wants to be the best (understandable), but scoring should be the least of the worries at any competition. Yes, you might come across some crappy judges, but you can weed those out with the universal scoring system. Makes it that much easier.  As a cheer community, we should know what is level 1 appropriate across the board, we should know what a level 4 athlete SHOULD be able to do. I also think the universal scoring system will eliminate competitions who allow teams to compete in a level they should not be in. If a team/gym/program continues to try and push their kids to compete at a level they’re not ready for, they won’t win, and parents will get upset and leave that program.

People think that in order to have a successful gym, you have to have higher level teams…WRONG! In order to have a successful team you need…let’s say it all together…PROGRESSION! So what if you’re 9 years old on a level 1 team? As long as you’re learning step by step, you’ll be a great level 3 cheerleader one day, or maybe not. Cheerelading isn’t for everyone.

Back to the scoring system. There are too many people trying to determine what makes cheerleading special, and the people with the most power are money hungry, which is why some of this stuff is still allowed. I would rather have less people spending money on a successful industry than taking people for all they have. Rarely do you have gymnastics programs that have a bunch of athletes that are competing at a level that they shouldn’t be; mainly because of the progression system. But I also think another reason, is because gymnastics has been around for many years and it’s very established. In the cheerleading world, we need someone to lay down the law, this is how it’s going to be, because I said so. Yes, there will be upset people, but that’s the way of the world. Nobody is entitled, and we need to let people know that. Let’s enjoy cheerleading, let’s make good cheerelading enjoyable, let’s have a universal scoring system that is used at EVERY. SINGLE. COMPETITION. so that there isn’t so much diversity in our community. We know everyone has their favorite team and people will always complain about how they feel someone should have won, which happens in every sport, but when there becomes a full on argument about why this team SHOULD have won based on “skill sets” that’s where it needs to end. As a coach, you should know how to max out the score sheet, and it should be obvious to other cheer fans, or easily explained to people why another team won. There shouldn’t be any questions about why a judge called a bobble this or that. Just like in football, penalties are called that not everyone agrees with, and sometimes they’re called wrong, but there are protocols for things like that for competitions. Just like in football, the coach can throw the red flag, there are rules like that in cheerleading. Those rules need to be regulated as well, but they definitely need to be rules.

So many ideas floating around that probably need to be put into action so that we can finally become a sport. I know I don’t know everything and I definitely don’t have ALL the answers but I’m sure a universal scoring system would help our “non sport” become an offical sport.

Thank you for reading!

Twitter: cheer_ology

Facebook: facebook.com/cheerology

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E-mail: cherita.cheerology@gmail.com

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“USASF” Judges

This is part two of my experience at the Hit Cheer and Dance competition. If you haven’t read part one, I highly suggest you check it out.  I also suggest that you read my NCA Judges ARE Fair post, just so you know how passionate and positive I am about the USASF judging system. I’m one to never question a judge, contest a score, complain about “bad” judging, or anything of the sort. BUT this was an instance where I just had to voice my opinion and try to UNDERSTAND how the judging system worked at this particular competition.

After day 1 was over, we were promised our score sheets and a day 2 schedule by 8:30 that night. 11:00 rolls around and we finally receive our e-mails. The program that I was with brought three level 1 teams to this competition. So when our head coach was reading our scores and our youth team had a score significantly lower than our senior team AND had a score lower than our mini team, I knew there was an issue. I’m not saying that our seniors or minis have a bad team, but they’re all level 1 and I know that our youth and seniors have the same amount of difficulty in their routines and that the minis don’t have as much difficulty as our youth and senior teams. If the scoring is USASF, there must be a judges error somewhere, which is fine, but I would like to get that fixed. Any judge knows how important scores are and knows that their job is to make sure scores are as accurate as possible so that the correct team wins.

Here’s a quick break down of how scoring works. For each level in cheerleading there are different skills that you are allowed to do that gets you into a certain scoring range. Cheerleading has 6 different levels and what is considered difficult in level 1 is not the same difficulty in level 3. Because there are different skills, there is a scoring grid that will let you know what criteria to meet to score in the highest range. This goes for tumbling (running and standing), pyramids, jumps, and stunts. So for any given category in any level you have to do a certain skill in order to obtain a high score. Any USASF score sheet has a skills grid to help the head judge place teams in the correct range. The panel judge then uses their expertise to score the team in the RANGE the head judge gave them. So there is no way that a level 3 team can do a level 1 skill and get scored in a 9-10 (out of 10) range. Or another example, a level 1 squad that does all cartwheels will not be in the same range as a level 1 squad that does back walkovers; same level, different levels of difficulty.

ANYWHO…I go up to one of the workers/volunteers of the competition and ask her if there was a process to contest scores. She said I could let her know my issue, she would talk to the head judge and then she would let me know the outcome. I told her my situation of how our youth team has 4 difficult level appropriate structures in their pyramid and our mini team has 1 average level appropriate structure in their pyramid and yet they were both scored the EXACT same in difficulty. Just as I explained earlier, there is a grid to put certain skills in a range, and 4 structures vs. 1 structure already puts the two pyramids in different ranges. I explained the situation to her, she went to talk to the head judge and he looked at my score sheet, told her “I remember that routine and I stand firm in what my judges scored” and left it at that. When the girl came back she informed me of what the head judge said and I told her I wanted to speak with him.  I wasn’t upset, I just wanted a better understanding and because the worker/volunteer didn’t know much or anything about cheer I wanted to talk to the judge one on one to get a better explanation.

So on to our conversation. About an hour and some change after my initial interaction with the worker/volunteer about my scores, I was finally able to talk to the head judge. I’m going to try to just recreate the entire conversation verbatim.

Me: Hi! My name is Cherita. *In a very chipper voice*

Judge: Hi, I’m Luis.

Me: I just had a few questions about my score sheet. I noticed that on my pyramid difficulty I received a 4 and my minis…

Judge: We’re not comparing.

Me: Ooohkay. *deep breath* Well in this instance I need to compare because it has to do with difficulty.

Judge: What is the issue?

Me: Well in my pyramid I start with show and goes…

Judge: Those are transitional skills.

Me: And they end in preps and on the outsides I have tic-tocs…

Judge: Which are also transitional skills.

Me: Not when they end in a heel stretch.

Judge: So how many structures do you have in your pyramid?

Me: I’m the coach, not the choreographer.

Judge: It doesn’t matter, you should know these things.

Me: Four, I have four structures in my pyramid, which should put me in a high range. Speaking of ranges, are you using a grid?

Judge: We’re using the varsity score sheet, you can look it

Me: I’m also a judge, so I know the score sheet, I don’t need to look it up. That’s not my question, I’m wondering if you’re using any kind of grid or range.

Judge: Look online.

Me: You’re not listening to what I have to say, and I don’t appreciate how you’re talking to me right now.

Judge: What’s the issue?

Me: My concern is how I’m in the same range as my mini team? I’m not comparing my team to another program, this is program to program comparing because it’s not consistent.

Judge: What is their pyramid?

Me: I know they have a lib to lib tic toc and that’s it.

Judge: So they only have one structure?

Me: I’m not their coach.

Judge: You should still know these things.

Me: No, I shouldn’t it’s not my team, it’s not my routine.

Judge: I don’t have time to ask my panel judge why they scored the way they did. Here. (handing me my score sheets back).

Me: *looks*

Judge: Do you want these or not?

Me: I’ll take them back, but I don’t understand why you’re acting the way you are. How can you call yourself a judge if you can’t justify anything you’re telling me.

Judge: WHAT PROGRAM ARE YOU FROM?

Me: And on that note, this conversation is over. *Drops mic, walks away*

As I’m walking away I can hear him yelling and screaming trying to figure out what program I’m from. Why? I feel threatened. Why does he need to know what program I’m from? I’ll give you my name, e-mail address, phone number, twitter handle, but you don’t need to take your immature actions out on my program. Mind you not once did I raise my voice or use a condescending tone with him. He was interrupting every sentence, he assumed I didn’t know what I was talking about. I was very professional and I don’t know if he felt threatened because I was questioning his judging, but the only thing I can think of is he thought I was some young dumb cheerleader volunteer who knew nothing. He had no legitimate answers for my valid questions.

So now my blood is BOILING, just reliving this moment makes my stomach hurt. I call my owner and let her know the situation and she plus another coach from my same program and one of my best friends from a DIFFERENT program come over because he saw that I was frustrated (to say the least). I’m telling them what just happened and I can see Luis talking to another lady who I guess is in charge of the competition. She comes over and I calmly tell her what happened and my situation about the judging. I also let her know that I didn’t appreciate the way he started talking to me and how he was rude from jump. She goes back to him, I see them talking, they come back together and all of a sudden “he understand where I’m coming from.” Is it because the other lady explained to him what I meant or was it because I had 3 extra people with me? Either way, I still was not happy with this man who claimed to be on the USASF board.

So now I’m asking him the same questions as before and I have my friends and owner also asking the same questions, because like I said before, I was just trying to get answers. I wasn’t debating numbers, I was trying to figure out the consistency. So finally my friend asked if the scoring was comparative at all. Meaning, are we comparing to a grid? Are we comparing to what we think a perfect routin is? And the answer we got was “no, this score sheet is all discretionary”. Soooo…then this isn’t judging, this is picking and choosing. Cool. Well, I got my answer. My answer was that this was not a competition that was being judged fairly or by any standards.

I know I’ve rambled and rambled on, but this is really something that had to be experienced first hand to get the entire feeling. Hopefully I’ve explained well enough for YOU to understand how awful the judging was in this competition. There are some other points about their judging I want to highlight.

  • The company didn’t provide spotters, and one team used their own spotters for their TINY team, and was deducted 10 points.
  • On their HIP-HOP dance score sheet, there was an area for leaps and turns, and one judge wrote “add leaps and turns”. Ummm…there is never a criteria for leaps and turns in a hip-hop routine.
  • My minis scored a 5/5 in MOTION TECHNIQUE. I don’t care if you are Mini Cheer Athletics Wildcats, Mini Cali Coed, Mini Brandon Senior Black…there is not one mini team in the history of life that earns a 5/5 in motion technique.
  • I was also told that they were not allowed to tell their panel judges to change their scores because there wasn’t a head judge setting ranges.

I’m pretty sure that’s most of nonsense I remember. This blog is to enlighten coaches, gym owners and USASF about what is being put out in the cheer world.

Share and comment! Thanks for reading!

Twitter: cheer_ology

E-mail: cherita.cheerology@gmail.com

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NCA Judges ARE fair!

Yes, I said it, and I will continue to stand by my word. As many of you know, the biggest Nationals in the nation happened this past weekend. If you happened to be on any form of social media, I’m sure you read the plethora of ignorant comments about how awful the judges are and how this sport is rigged. Let’s set one thing straight, just because you WANTED a team to win doesn’t mean they DESERVED to win. Whichever team won, won. Point. Blank. Period.

And who’s to say whether a team deserved to win or not? Those athletes worked SO incredibly hard to accomplish what they did. For you to take that away from them is rude and hurtful. How would you feel if you won worlds and you have a bunch of people saying another team deserved it? Of course you didn’t think of it that way. 

 For those of you who think the judges watch the routine and look at the team name on the uniform and whisper into the announcers ear who they THINK should win, have it allllll wrong. Anyone who thinks judges are biased are the people who would judge unfairly. Judges are professional, and there isn’t just ONE judge. I’ll give you a judging 101 lesson real quick. 

 There are usually 4 different types of judges at any given competition. The head judge, panel judge, rules judge, and deductions judge. Not one of these judges knows 100% what place any team is in due to how much goes into judging. If you’re still confused, I’ll explain a little further. 

 
Head Judge – This judge watches the routine and places the team into a specifc range based on what is put out on the floor. They don’t care how good or bad the skills are performed, they just need to know how many people or groups did the level (or non level) appropriate skills and places them in a range. It’s great that you have a standing back handpring, but if you’re in level 4 or 5, you’re not going to score as high as a team doing standing tucks, no matter how crappy they are.

 

Panel Judge – This judge is the one who gives the point scores. This is the judge who tells you what you need to improve on, and how you can score higher in the range that you are in. This judge can’t score any higher or lower than the range the head judge gives them. 

 
Rules Judge – This judge is watching for illegal stunts, tumbling, etc. Throughout the routine. This judge knows the levels and knows what is appropriate for each level.

 

Deductions Judge – This judge is watching for falls, touchdowns, bobbles, etc. This judge could care less that you did a double up, if you bobble or fall doing the double up, it’s a deduction. 

        Hopefully that clears things up. 

 People were SO upset that Top Gun won after they had 2 falls on day 2. I’m not sure if you watched day 1, but they hit day 1. Day 1 does mean something. They didn’t win by a lot, but because they did what they were supposed to do day 1, and they had a high raw score, that left room for error. I’m not saying everyone has to go out and try and throw extremely hard skills and fall because you will score higher, but they were good at the skills that they did and probably scored relatively high in execution.

Since everyone thinks the judges have it wrong because Cheetahs hit day 2 and OBVIOUSLY should have won…what about ACE Cheer Company? They hit zero deductions BOTH days and still got 4th. Why isn’t anyone complaining about that? Riddle me that one? Oh, probably because their RAW score didn’t match up to the teams ahead of them. But there’s NO WAY that a team could have dropped and won. With that theory all teams who hit should win. Every team in level 5 should do straight up libs as their elite, round-off back hanspring tucks as their tumbling pass, and single toe-touch to tuck as their jump sequence. It’s clean, it hits.

To make you feel more like cookie crumbs, what about this question…why isn’t anyone arguing about the placements of the special athlete division? Probably because you have no business judging them. They’re out there having a good time, and doing what they love! No difference between them and the worlds divisions. 

I’ve been hit with the “cheer is a subjective sport” crap. Guess what else is subjective? Gymnastics, ice-skating, diving, any sport that has a judge and not a referee. But for some reason, everyone involved in cheer thinks they are a judge because they prefer one team over the other. And this is one reason why cheer will NEVER be recognized as a sport. Parents, coaches, and athletes always have to put the blame on SOMEONE for why their team didn’t win. Nothing is ever fair in cheer. It’s all about the team name. If the issue is that bad, do something about it. Be the voice. Find out which judges are playing favorites. Stop complaining or stop cheering. I guarantee the same people who are complaining about “bad judging” are the SAME ones who are going to order the live stream of NCA next year and the year after that. 

 If we could come together as a cheer community, and not bash athletes, coaches, judges, whomever and become more family like, we will be able to weed out the fakes and phonies who like to have someone to blame all the time. Let’s stand up for our sport. Let’s make a difference and show everyone WHY we love our sport. 

 #rantover